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I'm a college student who befriended a blind student on campus. I led a campaign to raise $10,000 to pay for his guide dog expenses. Twice since then the dog was reclaimed by the guide dog school. What should I do? (self.Blind)
submitted by coolestnameavailable
I'm an undergrad student and I became friends with a fellow student on my campus. We'll call him Mike. He is blind and came back to college in 2012 to finish his undergrad (he's in his 40's). In 1997, he was struck by a drunk driver who fled the scene. He became completely blind, and has difficulty with balance and orientation, and also suffers from PTSD.
Two years ago I asked Mike why he didn't have a guide dog, and he told me that he was working on the extensive application process of getting approved for one. He told me that one of the application requirements was demonstrating to the guide dog school the ability to pay for related expenses of owning a dog. i.e., food, medical, dental expenses, etc.
My fraternity and I raised $10,000 to help this student with his guide dog expenses. He soon after got a guide dog from Guide Dogs of the Desert in Palm Springs in April 2015. This was shortlived however as after just a few weeks of having the dog at university, the dog was reclaimed because Mike was reported to be wandering into busy streets.
In Jan. 2016, Mike got another dog from the Eye Dog Foundation in Arizona. However again, Mike only had the dog for another few weeks before trainers determined to bring the guide dog back to the facility, due to the dog excessively barking, and challenging other dogs and people.
Mike tells me that he believes the main issue is that he and the dog are trained in quiet and easy to navigate areas, but then the dog gets stressed out and confused when he completes initial training and returns to our busy college campus with lots of people. Combine this with Mike's distorted orientation and PTSD from the accident, and I see how navigating blind with a dog can be difficult
So we're back at square one, applying to a different guide dog school. The money is still in the non-profit account that I opened. Is there anything else I can do? I'm worried the next dog will be the same story. What should I do with all this money? If it doesn't work out again, should I just donate it to a guide dog school?
$1
Two years ago I asked Mike why he didn't have a guide dog, and he told me that he was working on the extensive application process of getting approved for one. He told me that one of the application requirements was demonstrating to the guide dog school the ability to pay for related expenses of owning a dog. i.e., food, medical, dental expenses, etc.
My fraternity and I raised $10,000 to help this student with his guide dog expenses. He soon after got a guide dog from Guide Dogs of the Desert in Palm Springs in April 2015. This was shortlived however as after just a few weeks of having the dog at university, the dog was reclaimed because Mike was reported to be wandering into busy streets.
In Jan. 2016, Mike got another dog from the Eye Dog Foundation in Arizona. However again, Mike only had the dog for another few weeks before trainers determined to bring the guide dog back to the facility, due to the dog excessively barking, and challenging other dogs and people.
Mike tells me that he believes the main issue is that he and the dog are trained in quiet and easy to navigate areas, but then the dog gets stressed out and confused when he completes initial training and returns to our busy college campus with lots of people. Combine this with Mike's distorted orientation and PTSD from the accident, and I see how navigating blind with a dog can be difficult
So we're back at square one, applying to a different guide dog school. The money is still in the non-profit account that I opened. Is there anything else I can do? I'm worried the next dog will be the same story. What should I do with all this money? If it doesn't work out again, should I just donate it to a guide dog school?
$1
Pau_Zotoh_Zhaan 9 points 7y ago
Listen, I think what you had done, and are continuing to do for you friend, is fantastic.
I read about the problems you were having with the guide dogs and looked into the schools.
I've raised service dogs since 2007 but have never been hired by a school. This is my personal research and opinions.
The Desert School is lacking in information about the kind of training that is done at the campus. I don't know enough to make an opinion on the school itself but street guiding is a *fundamental* part of guide dog work and should never be an issue.
The Eye Dog Foundation of Arizona is not listed on Charity Navigator. I'm going to mention them in detail because I have heard of them. They were started with good intentions in CA but spilt after a dispute in the 70s. There has been concern in the past about fund management. The *Braille Monitor* also did an $1. If you have time give that a read.
Secondly, what to do you with the funds you raised? As you said, you do have two options. One is donate it and the other is try again for a dog.
There are a few questions you should ask yourself:
1. Is your friend responsible and self-sufficient enough to have a guide dog?
2. Will having a dog improve the quality of his life in ways that other assistance might not?
3. Is he willing to try again?
If the answer to all three is "yes" then I suggest The Seeing Eye in Morristown, NJ. It is a 501(c)3 non-profit organization. I have raised puppies for them and know their training quite well.
The Seeing Eye is the oldest and most established guide dog school in the U.S. Their $1 are pretty straight forward. They also provide their expectations of $1 which are great.
Each training session lasts 3 ½ weeks. $1 is some information about admissions. What I think The Seeing Eye does best is their gradual, off campus training with the people and their dogs. There is constant contact with the outside world during training and it is reflected in the quality of the dogs and the skills of the trainers. Morristown is great and a good size city to learn in. A university campus would be quiet compared to downtown - and that is the idea of getting practice in there.
Furthermore, the cost for a dog has not changed in a few decades - each dog is 150 USD. Housing and materials for classes are covered by donation. I pulled the full service post from $1. 150 USD covers:
The cost of the dog and its initial equipment
The student's instruction with the dog
Room and board during the 18 to 25 days the student spends at the school
Round-trip transportation from anywhere in the United States or Canada
Lifetime follow-up services
Average time from $1 to acceptance to the program is about four months. I suggest calling (973) 539-4425 and explaining your situation.
From Mike's past experiences with guide schools would donating the funds to those schools be appropriate? I honestly would hesitate on that idea for now.
If you have any questions or comments or anything at all do not hesitate to contact me and I'll get back to you ASAP.
Have a good night.
Edit: Forgot to add that at The Seeing Eye all students are granted full ownership rights over their dogs.
I read about the problems you were having with the guide dogs and looked into the schools.
I've raised service dogs since 2007 but have never been hired by a school. This is my personal research and opinions.
The Desert School is lacking in information about the kind of training that is done at the campus. I don't know enough to make an opinion on the school itself but street guiding is a *fundamental* part of guide dog work and should never be an issue.
The Eye Dog Foundation of Arizona is not listed on Charity Navigator. I'm going to mention them in detail because I have heard of them. They were started with good intentions in CA but spilt after a dispute in the 70s. There has been concern in the past about fund management. The *Braille Monitor* also did an $1. If you have time give that a read.
Secondly, what to do you with the funds you raised? As you said, you do have two options. One is donate it and the other is try again for a dog.
There are a few questions you should ask yourself:
1. Is your friend responsible and self-sufficient enough to have a guide dog?
2. Will having a dog improve the quality of his life in ways that other assistance might not?
3. Is he willing to try again?
If the answer to all three is "yes" then I suggest The Seeing Eye in Morristown, NJ. It is a 501(c)3 non-profit organization. I have raised puppies for them and know their training quite well.
The Seeing Eye is the oldest and most established guide dog school in the U.S. Their $1 are pretty straight forward. They also provide their expectations of $1 which are great.
Each training session lasts 3 ½ weeks. $1 is some information about admissions. What I think The Seeing Eye does best is their gradual, off campus training with the people and their dogs. There is constant contact with the outside world during training and it is reflected in the quality of the dogs and the skills of the trainers. Morristown is great and a good size city to learn in. A university campus would be quiet compared to downtown - and that is the idea of getting practice in there.
Furthermore, the cost for a dog has not changed in a few decades - each dog is 150 USD. Housing and materials for classes are covered by donation. I pulled the full service post from $1. 150 USD covers:
The cost of the dog and its initial equipment
The student's instruction with the dog
Room and board during the 18 to 25 days the student spends at the school
Round-trip transportation from anywhere in the United States or Canada
Lifetime follow-up services
Average time from $1 to acceptance to the program is about four months. I suggest calling (973) 539-4425 and explaining your situation.
From Mike's past experiences with guide schools would donating the funds to those schools be appropriate? I honestly would hesitate on that idea for now.
If you have any questions or comments or anything at all do not hesitate to contact me and I'll get back to you ASAP.
Have a good night.
Edit: Forgot to add that at The Seeing Eye all students are granted full ownership rights over their dogs.
coolestnameavailable [OP] 3 points 7y ago
Wow thank you for your thorough response!
We have been looking at schools in Southern California being that we go to university in San Diego. The Seeing Eye sounds great but not sure if that would be feasible at this time. I will talk to Mike about it though.
The next school we are looking at is Guide Dogs for America based out of Burbank, CA.
We have been looking at schools in Southern California being that we go to university in San Diego. The Seeing Eye sounds great but not sure if that would be feasible at this time. I will talk to Mike about it though.
The next school we are looking at is Guide Dogs for America based out of Burbank, CA.
Pau_Zotoh_Zhaan 2 points 7y ago
You're very welcome. I understand that you want to find a school "close to home" but a guide dog is, perhaps, unlike any other investment. So take time and make the chose that's right for you. Travel may be part of that!
Here are the Charity Navigator pages for $1 and the $1. They're a really good resource, giving the breakdown on where funds come from and how they are spent.
Here are the Charity Navigator pages for $1 and the $1. They're a really good resource, giving the breakdown on where funds come from and how they are spent.
Nighthawk321 1 points 7y ago
Just out of curiosity, how come you're trying to find a school close to where you live?
coolestnameavailable [OP] 1 points 7y ago
Mike tells me his PTSD prevents him from travelling by plane, so he is limited to places that he can travel to by train or by car.
geoffisblind 3 points 7y ago
I'm sorry about the situation your friend is in. I'm not a current guide dog handler but I am going to train in June with my first guide dog so take what I say with that in mind. With that being said I can say I have successfully navigated the application and admissions process to two schools. I did it with a lot of guidance from my orientation and mobility instructors and with a lot of research. I have heard of both organizations you have talked about and I have heard mixed things about each. I very rarely hear negative things about a school but I was advised not to apply to a certain set of schools if I possibly could, and unfortunately those two schools were a few of the ones that I was told to skip when applying. I like what /u/Pau_Zotoh_Zhaan said and would encourage you to look at some of the bigger, better known schools. I have never heard anything bad about the Seeing Eye and it is probably the most famous, but I would also look at Guide Dogs for the Blind which is where my SO's has gotten his past three or four with nothing but good coming out of it, or at Leader Dogs for the Blind which is a very well respected school. I met a guy who has been going to the Seeing Eye for years and who has had massive success, and I hear nothing but good about the other two. I think those three are your safe bets for success. If he wants a guide dog I would say don't give up, he clearly has an awesome support structure and definitely has the financial means to do it now. I'm going to have to shoulder the cost of food and vet bills during my first year of undergrad starting in the Fall and throughout the rest of my college career which is a sacrifice I decided is worth it, he is incredibly lucky to have an awesome group like your fraternity who put together $10,000 to make this possible. Basically shop around and make it happen, I don't think you should give up though. Again, not a handler, but I have been told by so many people that it is absolutely life changing when you have an effective guide dog team and it isn't something I would personally give up on. Best of luck man, if you have any questions let me know.
coolestnameavailable [OP] 2 points 7y ago
Thank you for your insights, our next school that we are looking at is Guide Dogs for America based out of Burbank, CA.
In regards to your financial struggle to support your guide dog, I think my fraternity may be able to help out. Let's exchange contact information, send me a PM.
In regards to your financial struggle to support your guide dog, I think my fraternity may be able to help out. Let's exchange contact information, send me a PM.
Nighthawk321 1 points 7y ago
Hmm, this is interesting. I'm no expert, so take what I say with a grain of salt. The first time the dog was repossessed, it sort of sounds like it was his fault. Maybe I'm wrong, so any clerification would be appreciatred. The second time is rather unfortunate. I do know that there are guide dog schools ranked lower than others. Maybe he needs to find a different one? I recently was about to apply to South Eastern in Florida, but have heard a hanfull of sketchy things about their dogs, so I applied to Seeing Eye in NJ instead.
coolestnameavailable [OP] 1 points 7y ago
I think in both situations, there was responsibility on both him, and I think preparation from his trainers. The next school we are looking at is Guide Dogs of America based in Burbank.
PuzzledPieces 1 points 7y ago
That's a tough situation. I myself am legally blind, I have a lot of friends who have gone through an organ based group called "Guide dogs for the blind" they do a lot if training and match you with a dog. I assume it's as extensive as the other two places. Perhaps try them? Was your friend observed by someone from the guide dog association he got them from before being taken?
coolestnameavailable [OP] 1 points 7y ago
The next school we are looking at is Guide Dogs of America based out of Burbank. And yes, on both occasions my friend was observed by trainers who came to our university in San Diego to watch him work with his guide dog before bringing the dog back.
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