Blind and Visually Impaired Community
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A friend with mannerisms is having trouble finding a job. (self.Blind)
submitted by KillerLag
I'd like to hear what people's thoughts are on this situation, and what I should do to help.
I have a friend who has quite noticable mannerisms (mostly rocking, but sometimes some hand stuff as well) when under stress. Other than that, he is fairly normal and handles his vision loss well. Unfortunately, due to the mannerisms, he has had trouble getting a job. He knows about his mannerisms but doesn't always notice when he starts doing them.
Complicating this slightly is the fact that he isn't a client of mine, he's a friend (I met him before starting my O&M program). I've mentioned to him that he has noticable mannerisms before, but he's never done anything to try to reduce them.
I'm not sure how appropriate it would be for me to offer to help him with some training to reduce his mannerism. I've taught him some O&M before, but he requested it when I went to visit him. What do you guys think about the situation?
I have a friend who has quite noticable mannerisms (mostly rocking, but sometimes some hand stuff as well) when under stress. Other than that, he is fairly normal and handles his vision loss well. Unfortunately, due to the mannerisms, he has had trouble getting a job. He knows about his mannerisms but doesn't always notice when he starts doing them.
Complicating this slightly is the fact that he isn't a client of mine, he's a friend (I met him before starting my O&M program). I've mentioned to him that he has noticable mannerisms before, but he's never done anything to try to reduce them.
I'm not sure how appropriate it would be for me to offer to help him with some training to reduce his mannerism. I've taught him some O&M before, but he requested it when I went to visit him. What do you guys think about the situation?
fastfinge 2 points 5y ago
This post could be about me, if I wasn't certain I didn't know you LOL. How do you know his mannerisms are what's losing him the jobs? Is it something he's brought up in conversation? If so, offering him help would be totally acceptable. But if it's just an assumption you've made about what's losing him the jobs, perhaps less so.
Speaking personally, I've had similar mannerisms when feeling any strong emotion (excitement, fear, whatever) since I was a child (nothing hand related, but OMG the rocking!), and tried dozens and dozens of things to stop it when I was a teenager. Absolutely nothing worked. Not even a little. At this point, if someone told me they knew I had mannerisms, I'd just nod and move on. I've totally given up on getting rid of them completely. These days, I just try to mitigate the problem: pull in close if I'm sitting at a desk so the desk will stop me from rocking, try and lean against something if I'm standing up, try not to experience strong emotions in public (mindfulness to calm myself before an interview or similar stressful situation often helps), etc. At least as I've aged, I've noticed the emotion that triggers it needs to be much stronger now than it did when I was a teenager.
So I wouldn't be surprised if your friend just isn't doing anything about his mannerisms because he doesn't believe anything can be done. Then again, if you offer training, I wouldn't think he'd be offended. But he may well brush off anything you offer with "tried that already."
Speaking personally, I've had similar mannerisms when feeling any strong emotion (excitement, fear, whatever) since I was a child (nothing hand related, but OMG the rocking!), and tried dozens and dozens of things to stop it when I was a teenager. Absolutely nothing worked. Not even a little. At this point, if someone told me they knew I had mannerisms, I'd just nod and move on. I've totally given up on getting rid of them completely. These days, I just try to mitigate the problem: pull in close if I'm sitting at a desk so the desk will stop me from rocking, try and lean against something if I'm standing up, try not to experience strong emotions in public (mindfulness to calm myself before an interview or similar stressful situation often helps), etc. At least as I've aged, I've noticed the emotion that triggers it needs to be much stronger now than it did when I was a teenager.
So I wouldn't be surprised if your friend just isn't doing anything about his mannerisms because he doesn't believe anything can be done. Then again, if you offer training, I wouldn't think he'd be offended. But he may well brush off anything you offer with "tried that already."
KillerLag [OP] 2 points 5y ago
I'm 90% sure we actually did meet before ;) From some of the things you mentioned before, I think I met you a few years ago at the CNIB office in Toronto. I may not have said anything because I was having lunch at the time (or maybe just made only a few comments). We can PM to dicuss more if you want.
In this case, he isn't being fired from a job, he is able to get interviews, but has never been offered a job. He knows his stuff pretty well (he knows a lot about phones and such, and one time, we were talking about my phone, and he knew the specs on my phone that was two years old. Like, down to the exact screen size and battery size).
Hand flapping is probably one of the most noticable ones (beacuse it is your hands in front of your face usually), but rocking is a close second. Years ago, I was dating someone who was blind who also had a tendency to rock (and rock fast). I leaned in for a kiss and got head-butted in the face :O
That is pretty much the major method of trying to control mannerisms, recognizing when you have them and beind mindfull and actively trying to stop it. One common technique is to try to pay attention to your back against the back of a chair. But yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if he doesn't think anything can be done. Or if things had been tries in the past but it didn't work out well. I'll ask his wife to see what she thinks.
In this case, he isn't being fired from a job, he is able to get interviews, but has never been offered a job. He knows his stuff pretty well (he knows a lot about phones and such, and one time, we were talking about my phone, and he knew the specs on my phone that was two years old. Like, down to the exact screen size and battery size).
Hand flapping is probably one of the most noticable ones (beacuse it is your hands in front of your face usually), but rocking is a close second. Years ago, I was dating someone who was blind who also had a tendency to rock (and rock fast). I leaned in for a kiss and got head-butted in the face :O
That is pretty much the major method of trying to control mannerisms, recognizing when you have them and beind mindfull and actively trying to stop it. One common technique is to try to pay attention to your back against the back of a chair. But yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if he doesn't think anything can be done. Or if things had been tries in the past but it didn't work out well. I'll ask his wife to see what she thinks.
Zach_of_Spades 1 points 5y ago
You know your friend better than I do, but please talk to him about it and not his wife. If I were the friend in question, especially if I was a blunt and to the point kind of guy, I'd want you to approach me about it and not someone else. Show the guy you respect him enough to bring it to his attention directly. I feel sure he'll appreciate your directness.
It gets really hard being in situations where people aren't up front with me because they want to preserve my feelings. For me personally, I'd want you to talk to me about it... even if it did make me mad.
Also, for what it's worth, his blindy mannerisms are probably not the reason he's having job troubles. Interviews don't necessarily mean us blind folks get jobs. As long as hr can cross having interviewed a real blind person for the position off their corporate bucket list, they can rest easy. Keep fighting the good fight, and good luck helping your friend.
It gets really hard being in situations where people aren't up front with me because they want to preserve my feelings. For me personally, I'd want you to talk to me about it... even if it did make me mad.
Also, for what it's worth, his blindy mannerisms are probably not the reason he's having job troubles. Interviews don't necessarily mean us blind folks get jobs. As long as hr can cross having interviewed a real blind person for the position off their corporate bucket list, they can rest easy. Keep fighting the good fight, and good luck helping your friend.
KillerLag [OP] 1 points 5y ago
His wife is leaving the country for a few weeks soon, so I'll probably be able to approach him directly. We'll see how that goes.
fastfinge 1 points 5y ago
> met you a few years ago at the CNIB office in Toronto.
Maybe. I've been in Ottawa for the past five or so years, so it'd have to have been quite a while ago. I definitely haven't been to the Toronto CNIB during the time I've interacted with you on Reddit. :-) But back when I lived in Toronto, I'd head down there once a year or so to get canes and/or bus passes. So I guess it's possible.
Maybe. I've been in Ottawa for the past five or so years, so it'd have to have been quite a while ago. I definitely haven't been to the Toronto CNIB during the time I've interacted with you on Reddit. :-) But back when I lived in Toronto, I'd head down there once a year or so to get canes and/or bus passes. So I guess it's possible.
KillerLag [OP] 2 points 5y ago
I've been working for CNIB about 10 years, but only been on Reddit for 5, so it would have predated my Reddit time ;)
laconicflow 1 points 5y ago
Listen. . . I used to rock. Daily and in public. To me, it felt normal. Like I wouldn't even notice I was doing it.
I remember I was like 16, 17, and I realized I wanted to have sex, so I made myself stop. It was hard and took a lot of willed effort to notice and stop. But I did it.
You gotta talk to this guy. Rocking makes a person look retarded and if he wants to not look retarded in public he has to stop.
When I started to stop, I just kept reminding myself, "You're in public!" and that knowledge eventually just sunk in until I didn't have to remind myself anymore.
Its not that you can make him stop, its that you can convince him he should stop.
That you are a friend rather than a professional is better.
When I began to stop, I told my best friend to punch me hard on the shoulder whenever I slipped up. Other solutions might be prefered for other people.
I remember I was like 16, 17, and I realized I wanted to have sex, so I made myself stop. It was hard and took a lot of willed effort to notice and stop. But I did it.
You gotta talk to this guy. Rocking makes a person look retarded and if he wants to not look retarded in public he has to stop.
When I started to stop, I just kept reminding myself, "You're in public!" and that knowledge eventually just sunk in until I didn't have to remind myself anymore.
Its not that you can make him stop, its that you can convince him he should stop.
That you are a friend rather than a professional is better.
When I began to stop, I told my best friend to punch me hard on the shoulder whenever I slipped up. Other solutions might be prefered for other people.
johnnytai -1 points 5y ago
If you know for certain that it is the mannerisms that cause him to not to get work, then it is worthwhile making a strong effort to help him correct them. But dare I say, there are so many blind people, qualified and no mannerishs to speak of, that can't find work in their own fields now a days, so the problem may not be as simple as stop rocking.
This is going to sound drastic and I'm in no way promoting things like this, just sharing a personal story. For those who believe "I can't change this no matter what" it is definitely possible to change- depending on what's the alternative.
When I was a teenager, I used to blink alot and rubbed my eyes. No matter what my mom did or said, nothing worked, I just couldn't help it! When I was thinking, my hands would wander up to my eyes, when I was nervous, I'd start blinking.
One day my dad said to me point blank, "Tell you what, you say you can't help it? From now on everytime I see you blink or rub your eyes, I'd smack you one, so you make the call."
Within 3 days and half a dozen hard smacks, I got rid of both mannerisms.
This is going to sound drastic and I'm in no way promoting things like this, just sharing a personal story. For those who believe "I can't change this no matter what" it is definitely possible to change- depending on what's the alternative.
When I was a teenager, I used to blink alot and rubbed my eyes. No matter what my mom did or said, nothing worked, I just couldn't help it! When I was thinking, my hands would wander up to my eyes, when I was nervous, I'd start blinking.
One day my dad said to me point blank, "Tell you what, you say you can't help it? From now on everytime I see you blink or rub your eyes, I'd smack you one, so you make the call."
Within 3 days and half a dozen hard smacks, I got rid of both mannerisms.
KillerLag [OP] 2 points 5y ago
I understand where you are coming from (my childhood involved some rather haarsh punishments), but I don't think physical assault is needed to effect change. While it can be quite effective in some cases, it is not always effective.
And you are right, he may not be able to get a job for something completely unrelated to his mannerism (he has a tendency to be very blunt as well). Not much I can do about that, unfortunately.
And you are right, he may not be able to get a job for something completely unrelated to his mannerism (he has a tendency to be very blunt as well). Not much I can do about that, unfortunately.
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