Blind and Visually Impaired Community
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What are the best ways to deliver or sell an accessibility app to low vision or blind people? (self.Blind)
submitted by NotHosaniMubarak
I'm working with a group that has created an app that can read cards and tiles then tell the user what they are via headphones. The hope is that it will allow visually impaired people to continue to play games which have secret hands like Poker, Dominoes, or Settlers of Catan.
The app works but needs some refinements and lots of training to recognize more types of cards and tiles.
We looking for grant funding to help pay for the testing and finish development. They want to know how we intend to get the product to our target market.
One member of our team is a blind game store owner and he's been an invaluable resource on accessibility and keeping the project on target. The rest of us are fully sighted people.
My research suggests that these might be good organizations to partner with and hosts of conferences and conventions that might be good to attend:
American Council for the Blind: http://www.acb.org/
Association for Education and Rehabilitation of the Blind and Visually Impaired https://aerbvi.org/
National Federation of the Blind: https://nfb.org/
National Library of Services for the Blind and Physically Handicapped : National Library of Services for the Blind and Physically Handicapped
But I generally believe the best way to know what any given population actually wants and how they want it delivered is to just ask. So I'm asking you. Does this project interest you at all and how would you expect to find out about this product once we release it for general use?
Thanks for you input,
NotHosaniMubarak
The app works but needs some refinements and lots of training to recognize more types of cards and tiles.
We looking for grant funding to help pay for the testing and finish development. They want to know how we intend to get the product to our target market.
One member of our team is a blind game store owner and he's been an invaluable resource on accessibility and keeping the project on target. The rest of us are fully sighted people.
My research suggests that these might be good organizations to partner with and hosts of conferences and conventions that might be good to attend:
American Council for the Blind: http://www.acb.org/
Association for Education and Rehabilitation of the Blind and Visually Impaired https://aerbvi.org/
National Federation of the Blind: https://nfb.org/
National Library of Services for the Blind and Physically Handicapped : National Library of Services for the Blind and Physically Handicapped
But I generally believe the best way to know what any given population actually wants and how they want it delivered is to just ask. So I'm asking you. Does this project interest you at all and how would you expect to find out about this product once we release it for general use?
Thanks for you input,
NotHosaniMubarak
matt_may 5 points 4y ago
The Apple App store.
GoBlindOrGoHome 5 points 4y ago
Before my vision got really bad I was just starting to love Yu Gi Oh, but damn people are impatient when it takes me two minutes to read each card. I don't blame them, really.
preiman790 2 points 4y ago
The player base is a little small. But there is a MUD that is completely compatible with screen readers that you can come play Yu-Gi-Oh on. If you want the info, let me know.
ErtaySh 3 points 4y ago
Hey I'm really interested in this project. I'm the creator of the Sightless Fun blog and podcast where I talk about visual accessibility in board games. Do you have some kind of prototype? What platform is the app currently on.?
If you guys need some exposure I would be happy to interview you on the podcast.
You can check the site here: https://sightless.fun
If you guys need some exposure I would be happy to interview you on the podcast.
You can check the site here: https://sightless.fun
Marconius 2 points 4y ago
I was a hardcore gamer before I lost my vision, and anything that would make it easier to make games accessible is very interesting to me. I personally have added braille to 3 full Cards Against Humanity sets including all expansions using a brailler and KNFB Reader to read the cards. I've since switched to SeeingAI since it's much faster.
I've also added braille to my set of Dominion, and in the same spirit of your app, I hand-coded an accessible website that I use with VoiceOver and my earbuds when playing with friends. The Dominion cards have braille codes and costs on them, and the braille codes, costs, explanations, and flavor text are all listed on my site. I have the basic sets and decks on individual pages using Heading navigation to jump between the cards, plus built a Deck Chooser where you can choose your own Dominion decks when making your own sets. If you are interested in checking that out, $1
Having something that could interact with an online database of cards or quickly read cards, dice, tiles, Catan roads and cost chips would be amazing.
Heading to all of those conferences would be a great idea, and you may get the most bang for your buck at NFB. It's pretty much the largest and most diverse gathering of blind folk here in the US.
I've also added braille to my set of Dominion, and in the same spirit of your app, I hand-coded an accessible website that I use with VoiceOver and my earbuds when playing with friends. The Dominion cards have braille codes and costs on them, and the braille codes, costs, explanations, and flavor text are all listed on my site. I have the basic sets and decks on individual pages using Heading navigation to jump between the cards, plus built a Deck Chooser where you can choose your own Dominion decks when making your own sets. If you are interested in checking that out, $1
Having something that could interact with an online database of cards or quickly read cards, dice, tiles, Catan roads and cost chips would be amazing.
Heading to all of those conferences would be a great idea, and you may get the most bang for your buck at NFB. It's pretty much the largest and most diverse gathering of blind folk here in the US.
Quineg 2 points 4y ago
Yes! This would be amazing. I love playing board games with my friends and while we have come up with some very clever and creative work-arounds, it is just not quite the same as being able to read my cards independently. If you ever need users or testers, please let me know because I am super excited about this idea. As for gaining product exposure, I think all the other comments had good ideas. Beyond that I would spread this by word of mouth to all my friends, even my sighted ones.
ErtaySh 1 points 4y ago
Hey what are your favorite games? I'm always on the lookout for fellow blind board gamers to talk to and share tricks.
Quineg 1 points 4y ago
Hey, yeah I listened to your first podcast about blind board gaming.I'm glad someone is doing that. It is really cool. Usually we play Secret Hitler, Resistance, Catan, Code Words, Sushi Go, Pandemic, Redacted as well as some others. In some of these there is currently just no way around having a sighted person help me out, but I have a system that works for playing Secret Hitler and Resistance that works well. I know you mentioned Secret Hitler on the podcast. Have you come up with your own system as well? I'd love to hear about it and share mine.
ErtaySh 1 points 4y ago
That's awesome, I'd like to hear how you solved the problem with closing your eyes and opening them to see your teammates.
I share my solution on the first episode in the podcast, I am guessing you listened to Episode 0 which was the short introduction episode. Here's a $1.
If you don't really have much time to listen to the episode, I've also written an article about it which you can find $1.
I share my solution on the first episode in the podcast, I am guessing you listened to Episode 0 which was the short introduction episode. Here's a $1.
If you don't really have much time to listen to the episode, I've also written an article about it which you can find $1.
Quineg 1 points 4y ago
Oh yeah, you are right of course, I had listened to episode 0 haha. Your app idea is fantastic though. That is so cool. So here is what I came up with: I also added just a tactile marker to the liberal policy cards which solves that problem nicely. The second part requires that everyone at the table has their phone with them. Everyone always does anyways lol. I have also added a single tactile marker to each fascist card and two tactile markers to the Hitler card, so I know my identity from the start. We do the whole intro sequence as normal, where fascists open their eyes and look around. After we complete the sequence, everyone at the table will text me. What they will text me is based on my identity and their own identity. For example, if I am a fascist, then my other fascist friend will text me and identify themselves as a fascist as well as tell me who is Hitler. Meanwhile everyone else at the table will send me a blank text or just some nonsense or a funny phrase or something. If I am a liberal than everyone just texts me nonsense. And if I am Hitler, then it is the same result as if I were a liberal. This system works for resistance as well, but not for Avalon expansion characters. The whole thing only adds about 30 seconds or less to the opening of the game and it only takes a couple games before it becomes a routine for everyone in the group. It's a very quick work around and allows someone VI to jump right into the game with minimal extra steps or setup. It also does not tip anyone any extra information about someone's possible identity, which is always a concern when trying to come up with VI friendly game modifications. Earbuds are also helpful to make sure no one else at the table hears my texts, but not a necessity. Let me know if you have any thoughts or possible variations on this system.
bleeblat 2 points 4y ago
I would be interested in this as well, since it could make a lot of situations easier to deal with, because braille cards are not always available, and I've played games with people in the past who were worried that I was cheating because I was touching the cards while shuffling, so this would get around that as well. I even have a few tarot decks and other things that'd be worth recognizing, if you need help testing. What's your strategy for getting card pictures into the app, without revealing your hand to an opponent by accident? That seems like it'd be tricky, but I like this concept. I'd say places like AppleVis, the app store, and maybe have it circulated to a few blindness mailing lists as well. I think there are a couple iphone and mac lists and a few lists for other screen readers. Also, if you get your ad in other games that blind people are playing, you might hit some that way. Talk to the people at appa11y and see what they're doing, for example. But definitely if you mention voiceover or talkback support in your store description you'll get a few downloads just for doing that. I'm more likely to pay for an app that claims to be fully accessible than I'd be to chuck a few dollars at something, only to find out it's unusable. I'm also more likely to buy in-app things if the developers maintain reasonably working accessibility. That means quite a bit, because it's so rare still, but extremely helpful.
estj317 2 points 4y ago
I am quite interested this sounds like a great idea actually. I don’t usually play games honestly but it would make playing a game very interesting and fun and it would make it accessible. For instance if I was playing a game that had cards not accessible I would have access, even if I forgot my regular deck of cards at home. At the moment I don’t own a regular deck anyway. That’s how little I play games.
Here are some more organizations that may help. And a website.
Applevis.com is very useful. I look on there for most of my apps
Afb or american foundation for the blind.
Aph american printing house for the blind, maybe? Not sure if they are the best.
Junior blind of america may be able to help.
Maybe the light house organization
How about the lions club?
Stuff like that?
Here are some more organizations that may help. And a website.
Applevis.com is very useful. I look on there for most of my apps
Afb or american foundation for the blind.
Aph american printing house for the blind, maybe? Not sure if they are the best.
Junior blind of america may be able to help.
Maybe the light house organization
How about the lions club?
Stuff like that?
theWriteAmy 1 points 4y ago
u/marconius might be interested in this.
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