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Blind and Visually Impaired Community

Full History - 2019 - 10 - 12 - ID#dh4dzs
4
Opinions Needed for Art Inclusivity (self.Blind)
submitted by TheCuriousWorlds
Hi there! My name is Lauren, and I am a sighted artist that is working on a highly detailed photography project. For this project, I was awarded a grant that is tied to a fandom. This is my first time making art for (lots!) of people I don't know, so inclusion is extra-important, but I have never met a blind person and I have no understanding of what constitutes a good experience. To make this an even taller order, these photos are extremely complicated; regular alt-text wouldn't begin to cover what is going on in them, so some pretty verbose descriptions are needed. I need advice, please, specifically-

​

1. Would it be pleasant/enjoyable to have a page of detailed description of a photograph?
2. Do whole sentences and/or a narrative structure help, or is it easier to piece something together with a series (in effect: "There is a delicate teacup to the right of the ratty broom," versus "Left to right: ratty broom, delicate teacup")?
3. Am I just being an idiot sight-person and this is, in part or all, pointless, rude, ineffective, patronizing, or biased?

​

I welcome and appreciate any thoughts or suggestions you have!
Amonwilde 3 points 3y ago
This seems like you're putting in serious thought and care on this issue. I'll give you my take, with the caveat that I'm not speaking for everyone in the community.

Often when people write alt text they have a hyperfocus on objects and their spatial relationships. Your example with the broom is pretty representative of this. What's better is to go up one level of abstraction and think more about the purpose of why you're sharing or exhibiting the photograph.

Less useful: A photo of a smiling older woman wearing a pointy hat sitting at a table. There are candles on the cake, which are lit. There is a cat sitting on a windowsill in the background.
More useful: My grandmother's birthday party. She's about to blow out the cake, and we're all smiling.

If there is a person in a blue dress in your photo, you don't need to say the dress is blue unless it's salient to why you're sharing the photo or unless you anticipate a specific use case for the photo that requires that information.

If you want blind people to be able to participate in your exhibit—appreciated—I'd recommend going the narrative text route that you laid out. Articulate the meaning, purpose, and importance of what you see, rather than the minutiae. I wouldn't write reams of text—a picture might be worth a thousand words, but a blind person isn't going to read a thousand wrds for every photo. Fundamentally, a photo is a sighted medium, so there's some extent to which you'll be leaving blind people out by the exhibit. That's largely OK, your responsibility (moral if not legal) is to provide reasonable accommodations, and that mean the experience isn't 100% translated into an accessible format.

Hope that helps, happy to follow up if you ask questions.
TheCuriousWorlds [OP] 2 points 3y ago
Thank you so, so much- this is tremendously helpful!

Would it be useful to add details about scent, texture, or temperature? There are layers and layers of details in these images because they are collages of objects. It's inspired by the kid's book series 'I Spy'; they were so formative for me, but I haven't found anything that makes that experience accessible.
Amonwilde 1 points 3y ago
If you still have the source collages, allowing VI people (or everyone) to experience them with their fingers and nose might be an approach. You could consider having a station with an example collage at the exhibit, it might even make you stand out a bit. If it's talking about the temperature, etc. in an alt text like medium, that seems a little strange to me, since sighted people aren't going to be able to experience the temperature through the photos. Though of course you can and should describe those phenomena if that's the feeling you're trying to evoke visually in the photo. Remember that most blind people are not blind from birth and most have some vision, so while you want to be inclusive of the totally blind you shouldn't be assuming no knowledge of the visual world on the part of your blind patron. Even those who are totally blind know about sighted stuff and how sighted people think and have associations with color, etc. by virtue of living in a sighted world and having sighted people talk about that stuff endlessly. Hope that makes sense.
TheCuriousWorlds [OP] 1 points 3y ago
Sadly, the collages are destroyed after being photographed. But that's an interesting idea for a new project, especially since so many of the components are scale model pieces that are built to be handled.

I have no concept of how many blind people had/have vision and experience with color, yikes on bikes I need to educate myself. You mentioned people that are totally blind developing an association with color, is the same true for light levels (dim, bright), or is that a more natural association drawn from heat/temperature?
Amonwilde 1 points 3y ago
The association I mention is more an abstract association, like something you read about, not the visceral one that sighted people have. I'm very low vision, though (20/800+) so I don't want to speak to how the totally blind experience color, but my understanding is that it's more like an academic understanding of the kind of association mapping sighted people have than a personal experience.
sinabahram 2 points 3y ago
Thank you for the clear levels of dedication and consideration you are putting into this project. There are some best practices around a visual description, which can serve as a good starting point. Discussing a photographs contents really depends on the photo itself. Different visitation patterns, like clockwise or quadrant-based or linear, can be used to help the person who can’t see the photo to build a mental model in which you can fill in all of the details you are speaking about. I’ve done a considerable amount of work in the space, and we regularly hold visual description workshops for people in the culture sector, especially museums. Happy to share specific tips and resources. Does your project allow for tactile reproductions? When coupled with guided tactile descriptions and visual descriptions, they can be a wonderful multi modal way of conveying visual information. This is the approach we took with the Andy Warhol Museum and the Canadian Museum For Human Rights, the latter of which actually has had multiple exhibits, traveling ones, consisting of lots of photographs. We’ve also found that making sure the description is able to be accessed both as a recording as well as programmatically, helps a whole lot. Someone like myself who prefers very rapid speech can easily read a 350 word description in 15 to 20 seconds, but someone else may prefer to listen to that 350 word description over the course of two minutes as a pleasant voice Recording. At the end of the day, this is about returning agency to the visitor, and there are some inexpensive ways of doing that as well as higher quality ways if you’ve got some budget for things like reproductions. Art Beyond Sight has some guidelines that we like to start with Wynn showing people how to do visual descriptions. There is good advice in those like how to use metaphor appropriately when discussing differences in colors.
Happy to talk more about this. Feel free to reach out.
TheCuriousWorlds [OP] 1 points 3y ago
Holy smokes, thank you very much. I will be unpacking this wisdom for a hot minute!
AllHarlowsEve 2 points 3y ago
I agree that the point of the image is the most important part. I've used many analogies to explain it in the past, but a logo is an easy way to show what I, personally, like.

From real bad to good:

- logo.jpg

- Businesslogo.jpg

- The logo for Business Inc.

- A tree with leaves making the logo of Business Inc.

- A tree in the background, its leaves spilling down in the reds, oranges and yellows of the Medieval helmet of the Business Inc. logo

Then, the amount of detail can get to be too much.

- In the background, blurry leaves blend into green grass. A gnarled oak spills its branches out in every direction like a pom pom, a few leaves sticking to the branches still. The gold leaves make up the base of a helmet, red and orange leaves creating the visor and plumage. In a large Serif font, Business Inc is written, a thin double underline cutting through the very bottom of the words.

That description may be good in some contexts, but annoying in others.

- The green grass of a park is blurred, blades indistinguishable from one another. Autumn leaves lay on top, blurred into firey piles at the base of an old tree. Its mostly bared branches stretch in every direction, the few leaves it still has focused on the left side. Their angles seem as if the wind is blowing gently. Next to the tree, with a little space to let the blurry green grass show through, is the helmet of Business Inc.'s logo. Various shaped leaves form together, red spade shaped ones creating the slots of the visor and much of the plumage of the medieval helmet. The other leaves, golden yellow and orange, vary in shapes although most are maple shaped.

That one is just a whole lot of information, and I would only expect it if it was extremely important, like in an art class, to understand the composition.
TheCuriousWorlds [OP] 2 points 3y ago
That is an amazing analogy, and a huge relief to boot.


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