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Blind and Visually Impaired Community

Full History - 2020 - 10 - 25 - ID#jhy1ty
10
Is it okay to heal blindness in a fantasy setting? (self.Blind)
submitted by Perepip
I hope this is okay to post here. I've tried researching this sort of thing, but all I could find was Biblical references and faith healing information, but that's not what I'm looking for. I'm looking for an answer to this question because I know in the deaf community the idea of "curing" deafness isn't well received, and I want to avoid making a similar mistake with the blind community.

As for the context, I am writing a comic where one of the main characters has the ability to heal sickness, visual impairments, and even death in living creatures. It's implied he can heal just about anything. I am writing a fan comic, so this character already exists with this power and I'm just putting him in a new story. My original idea for my story included a blind character, but as I continued writing I realized it would be odd for the issue of "healing" his eyesight to never come up, since it's something we know the healer can do. The blind character, in my head, has never been able to see so the experience would be new to him. I thought I would write it as exciting, but scary, and hard to comprehend to begin with. I intended to write it so that he would struggle with understanding depth perception, how bright lights can be, and other things of that nature. I want to write something that would be accurate to this experience, but I only want to do this if it's not disrespectful to blind people to do so. It is far more important to me that I don't write a story that would genuinely upset people, or to make it seem like blindness is something that is unacceptable. I know I don't want to frame it in a way that makes it seem like he's lacking something. Before he would be healed, he would be portrayed as a completely average boy who just happens to be blind and it wouldn't impede him in the story.

Two versions of the story I could do would be that gaining eyesight would be the result of an accidental encounter with the healer, or the blind boy could directly ask the healer if it could be done because it's something he would want to experience (out of curiosity, not because he feels insecure). Would one be preferable to the other? Would the entire premise be offensive? I'm sorry if even asking this question is offensive, I just genuinely don't know the answer and want the opinions of people who actually are or who frequently work with people who are blind.

ETA: The healer in question is a hybrid, the only one of his kind, and the only one in the world that we know of who can heal. He heals using his spit or tears, so something as simple as sharing a juice box with him was able to heal his friend's poor eyesight in the original story.

Edit 2: I did end up deciding to go with a character who wasn't blind instead, for various reasons. Mostly, I feel like I wouldn't be able to do the character or the storyline I had planned justice. Thank you to everyone who offered their thoughts! All of them were really helpful, and helped me understand people's opinions on blind characters better.
LadyAlleta 6 points 2y ago
Honestly, I would say don't heal him or just make him sighted off the bat.

If your mc is a healer that is capable of this, then there needs to be an in world reason why long term blindness exists.

If healers can fix almost anything, then medical/disabled communities probably don't exist. And that's ok. Fantasy is fantasy for a reason.

If there are disabled and sick communities then why do they exist? It's a limit on the magic/tech? Money? Religion (do communities that live in a world devoid of disability see disabled people as Demi gods or something? Kinda odd but a possibility)

If you want an easy reason, you can say that the blind character was born without eyes or something. Nothing to heal. But then they can't use magic to "see" please. Using magic to heal or negate the disability is really infuriating and I usually rage quit the book.
smarthome_fan 3 points 2y ago
>Using magic to heal or negate the disability is really infuriating and I usually rage quit the book.
I agree. It feels very cliché. It can also be very triggering for people in those disability groups since people often undervalue them—and tell them they should be "healed" or "cured"—their entire lives rather than recognizing their potential.
ukifrit 5 points 2y ago
on Patric Rothfuss's universe, some forms of blindness can be cured. But the author was careful enough to tell a person cured this way is mostly like a child, they can't really recognise stuff visually after the surgery. Quite common sense, I'd say.
Perepip [OP] 1 points 2y ago
The in universe reason for all of this is because this particular healer is the only one who can heal people that we know of. He gets the power from his mother, who was also the only one that we know of that was capable of doing it and he's the only one of his kind. The source material also doesn't make it clear whether his healing powers could, to use your example, create eyes for someone who was born without them or not. I had actually considered using the blind character not being born with eyes as a reason why he *couldn't* be healed but I wanted to get more of an understanding for how blind people feel about this.

Thank you for your response! All of them help me understand this better.
LadyAlleta 3 points 2y ago
I hope it helps. I personally don't like when blind characters are healed. But if you keep them blind you'd really need to hash out their adaption and how they struggle. But best of luck.
blindchickruns 5 points 2y ago
If the individual has been blind since birth, it's a no go. Studies have shownthat we as human beings develop a database in our brains in reference to sight starting at a very young age. if the individual in question has never had sight they do not have that database therefore it would be basically inundating the brain with information that has no context and is therefore not useful. if the individual has been totally blind for a number of years that database might be hard to access by the brain. It would not happen quickly it would be like teaching a toddler how to walk. And with later stages in life in the brain not being as a plastic it may never fully take.

so healing would really only be plausible with someone in late stages of a disease slowly taking their sight. Something like retinitis pigmentosa might be plausible to heal if the person did not have a fast acting version of it that took vision very young. someone that lost their sight may be in their 30s and 40s could possibly maybe see again. But this is according to studies done today.

Now if you think that we have a community as blind individuals like the death do? I mean not really. We don't really have our own culture. There is no language that we use exclusively. We are members of society just like everyone else; we just can't see you. So go ahead and have a bad hair day in front of us we don't care.
Perepip [OP] 1 points 2y ago
This is all really great information, thank you! I honestly didn't think about it like that, the database thing. I had assumed (probably incorrectly) that it would be hard for them to learn how to identify things by sight, like perhaps they would have troubles telling faces apart or something to that effect, but that they would ultimately be able to make the connections and learn. Thank you so much for bringing this to my attention.

Honestly I wasn't sure if there was really a community or not. I've never really been close to anyone who was blind, and I couldn't find much information on how a blind person might feel about this sort of thing just from Google. If I did end up pursuing this story thread, I'd really have to do a lot more research.
blindchickruns 3 points 2y ago
This will blow your mind. If you have never seen a face, how do you even know what it looks like? What is red or blue? You learned these things over years. Feeling a square and seeing a square are two very different things. Being told something is green and seeing what shade of green it is? Yeah, it's like that. I am learning what my green t-shirt feels like as opposed to seeing it. Now suddenly reverse that? Now my mind is blown. I'll need a lot of weed to cope with that.
Perepip [OP] 1 points 2y ago
I actually have considered these things before, specifically because the woman who raised me had such bad eyesight that she couldn't identify faces until she got her first pair of heavily corrective glasses at 16. I know that it's not the same as full blindness, but that was part of my bases for assuming that someone who was blind fully would have troubles telling faces apart, but would eventually "learn" to be able to do so. By learn, I suppose I mean the mind making the connections between what it's seeing and comprehending that. I hadn't considered that it might potentially be impossible for the connections to be made, so it's definitely something I need to consider.
TastyMushroom 2 points 2y ago
You can have your healer restore the character’s eyes, but since there’s no visual database, the blind character would still be functionally blind. Except now they have a flood of information coming in they can’t process, giving them sensory processing disorder and a sense of disorientation they didn’t have before. The blind character might decide to put a blindfold on and continue life as normal.
smarthome_fan 1 points 2y ago
Very well said.
DrillInstructorJan 2 points 2y ago
The shouty political part of the deaf community can go jump in a lake. Offer me a cure, I'll take it. Don't get me wrong, in the meantime I'm getting on with life, but I'll absolutely take it if it comes.

Yes, it's fine. People don't have to like it. Nobody's your boss.
smarthome_fan 2 points 2y ago
You did read the thread right? This is about the blind community—not the deaf community. OP, is this the readership you're looking for?

Also, the fact that people would likely take any advantage they could get (including sight if it was available to me) it doesn't address whether this text is perpetuating stereotypes that many would find harmful.
DrillInstructorJan 0 points 2y ago
I thought it was a fairly clear parallel.

If you're going to get all upset every time someone perpetuates a stereotype about blind people you're going to, well, spend a lot of your life upset. I think it's better just to make sure you're a convincing counterexample and move on. Getting all wound up about it doesn't make anyone look good, it just risks looking whiny.
smarthome_fan 2 points 2y ago
But the OP asked a specific question and I gave a specific answer, as did you. I'm not sure either of us are getting wound up, we're simply engaging in a discussion on Reddit. Logically, you're correct—if no one got offended about anything, it would certainly save a lot of energy. However humans are more than lumps of flesh and bone, and our lived experiences are going to mean we're passionate (and possibly triggered) by certain things. At the end of the day, responses like yours "no one should be offended" aren't helpful (minimizing others’ experiences) and merely help to fuel the flames.
DrillInstructorJan 0 points 2y ago
I start to lose interest in this sort of discussion when people start using words like "triggered" in that sort of context. The term was originally used to describe problems suffered by people with severe diagnosed mental health issues, not someone who just happened to have read something they don't like on the internet and was having a hissy fit about it. If someone's peace of mind is going to be that seriously affected by someone writing a fantasy story, that person has more problems than the fantasy story.

Even if you could stop people writing crappy fiction about blind people, which you can't, it's a much better idea to work on your own head space to the point where it doesn't seriously disturb your zen. In the end no mental health professional would ever advise someone to deal with a problem like that just by avoiding it, because you can't guarantee to avoid it for the rest of your life.

If someone walks up to you and steals your cane for a laugh, I care. If someone won't give you a job because they can't be bothered to buy you a copy of JAWS, sure, I care. But if I come across a really bad bit of writing involving blind people, I tend to metaphorically face palm, think, oh god, that again, and go on with my day. If you can't do that, that's something you need to work on.
mehgcap 2 points 2y ago
I'm going to get downvoted for this, but I think you're coming at this in a good way. I like the idea of your blind character being interested in experiencing sight, not seeking it out as a way to complete himself. I also like the idea of exploring the consequences of an accidental healing. In either case, as long as you keep the focus on the character not being better than he was when blind, I think you'll be okay. What about your healer character finding a way to "heal" this blind character back to blindness? That could leave the choice up to the blind character and make for an interesting exploration.

Whichever way you go, I think you generally have this right. You've thought about the impact on blind readers, and you're being careful not to portray blindness too negatively. The fact is that there are downsides to being blind, and talking about them isn't a bad thing. You're not taking that as license to make the blind character incomplete, though, which is good.
Perepip [OP] 1 points 2y ago
Ah thank you. I'm glad I was able to get across my intentions! I definitely want to do it right if I do it at all. If it's too sensitive a subject for the community I'm definitely not going to go down this route, but I would really like to and if I do I absolutely have to do it in a way that doesn't make it seem like blindness is bad or lesser than being sighted.

Thank you for your input!
smarthome_fan 1 points 2y ago
It's not a question of the community being "too sensitive" or not, it's about you determining where and how to draw the line with the art you're creating.
Perepip [OP] 1 points 2y ago
I'm sorry, I didn't mean to phrase it that way. I meant more along the lines of this is a topic that I can't relate to, and I don't want to do it in a way that harms people who do relate to it. I sincerely apologize for wording it like that.
siriuslylupin6 1 points 2y ago
I wouldn’t do it. Just doesn’t really seem very pragmatic.
Urithiru 1 points 2y ago
I know I'm late to comment, just stumbled on this thread. I would recommend you look into Brandon Sanderson as an author who is trying to do disability representation well. He is doing this mostly with his Stormlight Archive series which is an epic but if you like fantasy and can binge the series and drop into the fandom you might find a lot of relevant discussion and/or guidance. Sanderson has a youtube where he posts his Creative Writing lectures from BYU so that may be a good place to start for writing advice in general.
RollForParadise 1 points 2y ago
I know exactly what TV show you were talking about :-)

Considering the context of the show I’d say if you come at it from the right angle it would be fine. Do you want to heal a human or jem? I’d say that’s the important question. And which season would it take place in? Or is this after future? Anyways if you decide to go ahead with this I would love to read it and help out as much as possible! Let me know if you are interested :-)
Perepip [OP] 1 points 2y ago
It's an alternate universe version of the show, and the character was going to have his eyesight healed instead of Connie's in the first season. It was a human boy, and he was going to be a love interest for my original character, who is Steven's twin sister in my comic. I did decide to go with a different character instead, one who wasn't blind, just because I didn't think I would be able to navigate the topic myself. But thank you so much for offering your help! I revealed the character design for the new boy on Halloween, so it's too late to go back to the original one now.
RollForParadise 1 points 2y ago
Oh nice! No worries I always forget to check when posts were created. Anyways I’d still love to check out the comic in the future if you’d like to share! I’m so happy that the fandom is still going strong even though the show has ended… I mean I still have A lot of my favourite episodes saved on my cable box LOL ^-^
Alaisha 1 points 2y ago
Oh, and I personally don't like the assumption that blind people feel faces or count steps, but it is your universe and I appreciate that you are interested in how blind people fit into things.
Perepip [OP] 1 points 2y ago
Is this based on something I said? I don't recall implying I assumed either of those things, because I know blind people don't feel faces and I've never heard of them counting steps, but if I accidentally said something that made you think that I apologize.
Alaisha 1 points 2y ago
I'm just saying in general lol. It's portrayed in a lot of the movies and shows and books. Just saying that's another thing I'm not particularly fond of. You can heal your blind person if you want. It's your book. It would be cool in the future to see more books where blind people can remain blind and overcome whatever challenges in that universe. If this isn't one of those, that's fine. It's your creation.
Revenant624 1 points 2y ago
I personally have no problem with it. I know if I had the opportunity to give me perfect vision I would jump at the chance. Just remember not be able to make everybody happy, someone will always find something to bitch about. I personally don’t find it offensive. For example, some people find Mr. Magoo offensive, I just find him funny. LOL
smarthome_fan 1 points 2y ago
I don't think it's a matter of people "bitching" about it or not, it's that sometimes when portraying minority groups in media and literature it's easy to perpetuate pre-existing stereotypes about that minority group. It would be similar to creating a character from a different race from yours and making them hyper-sexualized. Or portraying another minority group as submissive and meak. In this case the author wants to portray a person with a disability as sick and in need of being healed or cured which is a common stereotype that I believe many people don’t identify with. If I knew there were no disadvantages or risks, I might agree to get my full vision. But I am also leading a full life as is and don't want to be thought of as incomplete or "waiting around for a cure".

In the end I'm not complaining, just providing some points for the author to contemplate before deciding in which direction to take the narrative.
Perepip [OP] 1 points 2y ago
This is definitely what I'm worried about. I don't want to portray the character as sick or *needing* a cure. There's nothing inherently wrong with being blind and I don't want anyone to think that that's the motivation for doing this.

In the original story, the healer has... as gross as it is... healing tears and spit. He accidentally "heals" a friend who needs glasses so that she doesn't need glasses anymore. Knowing that this is something he can do, among the other things he can "fix" (though I know it's not really something to be fixed) it would make sense that the logical conclusion would be that he would also be able to heal blindness. It's a passive effect, he doesn't actually have a say on what is and what isn't going to be healed. It just heals everything in one go as far as we can tell.

And I know I keep using the term heal but that's strictly because I don't know a better term to use in this situation.
smarthome_fan 1 points 2y ago
I can't say this is something I would personally dig because people are so hyperfocussed on "fixing" blindness and finding a "miracle cure" that this idea perpetuates the disempowerment of this disability group. Having sight is a definite advantage, but blindness isn't an illness and not everyone wants to wait around for a miracle cure.

I know you'll get different opinions which is why you asked here, but personally I wouldn't be likely to read literature from that genre and I would strongly discourage friends, family, and my partner from reading it too. I am disappointed to see disempowered blind characters receive a miracle cure from a heroic protagonist. Create a dynamic, empowered, independent blind character, someone with a set of challenges but someone not defined solely by his blindness, and you will have done some great character development.
Perepip [OP] 1 points 2y ago
This is definitely why I asked. This kind of input is infinitely helpful. Knowing that it's not just something that would bother people, but actively make them turn away other people from engaging with it, is something I have to take into consideration. Even if everyone else thought it was a good idea, I would still be thinking about this answer because it's so personal to you. I have to weigh every response I get to come up with the best character.
Revenant624 0 points 2y ago
All is needed is to be respectful as possible, just because someone is blind does notmean they’re helpless and that is all that needs to be conveyed.
smarthome_fan 2 points 2y ago
Hey I'm not saying there's some moral imperative here. You can create art and make it almost however you like. It can be ironic, empowering, disempowering, and portray people however you choose.

I'm just saying that as part of a minority group that has spent literally my entire life trying to prove that sure, I might take vision if I had the chance, but I'm not broken and don't need to be fixed or healed; this text would likely be triggering to others in this minority group and perpetuate unwanted stereotypes. Just as it's easy to do when writing about a race, gender, disability group, or other minority that you aren't a part of. How you want to take that opinion and proceed is completely up to you.
Perepip [OP] 0 points 2y ago
Thanks for this! I know that it's a very personal thing, and that some people are okay with it while others aren't. That's definitely part of why I'm asking a bigger group like a Reddit community.
Revenant624 0 points 2y ago
Not a problem, like I said he will not be able to make everyone happy. The main thing is just to be as respectful as possible. Just remember because people are blind they are not helpless
Perepip [OP] 1 points 2y ago
Oh for sure. Before he would be healed, if I do that storyline, he would be keeping up with the others just fine. No bumping into anything, no needing people to usher him around, nothing like that. His being blind wouldn't be used in any way to show that he's not experiencing the world fine as he is. I'm also planning on researching guide dogs to make absolutely sure I portray them accurately, too.
Revenant624 0 points 2y ago
Having and seeing eye dog myself they are absolutely amazing.
bradley22 -2 points 2y ago
Go for it, it’s your world and life. If people get offended; let them and move on.
smarthome_fan 1 points 2y ago
So I used to watch the show Two and a Half Men many years ago. It was a comedy, and since I had a fairly sheltered upbringing it talked about things I'd never been exposed to.

Now when I talk to women I know they tell me that the show is actually very triggering since it portrays awful gender stereotypes. I could either shrug and say "it's my world, if you're offended then that's your problem" or I could acknowledge that maybe shows like this do some real harm.

I am in no way trying to compare the content of Two and a Half Men with the proposed content of the book. Just pointing out that the portrayal of disability-related stereotypes that many people spend their lives trying to move past may trigger some readers. And to shrug off their experiences isn't great IMO.
bradley22 1 points 2y ago
It personally doesn’t bother me if the OP writes their book in this way and I think if blind people get offended they need to take a walk outside. It’s just a book.
smarthome_fan 1 points 2y ago
I think it's perfectly fine if you aren't offended, but I don't think you can tell others how they "should" feel. Question, would you say the same thing if women are offended by a show like Two and a Half Men?
bradley22 0 points 2y ago
Honestly? Yeah, probably. Thing is; people are going to choose, and it is choosing, to get offended over things, that's just how the world works.

I say let them get offended and write your story anyway because 1. It could be an amazing story and 2. If we went around worrying what peple think about us all the time; we'd get nothing done.
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