Blind and Visually Impaired Community
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How important is alt text? (self.Blind)
submitted by 258professor
I teach college courses, and with online courses, I've learned how to make alt text for pictures and graphs. I recently discussed with a colleague, and she said that if the image is not "academic" related, then we can just check "decorative image" instead of providing alt text. This colleague insisted that images such as the instructor's face, or a green checkmark at the bottom of a list to indicate students were completed with a page, did not require alt text. While not relevant to the academic content, I feel they were relevant to a student's ability to succeed in the class and to feel good about their progress.
I am Deaf, and have had the unfortunate experience of others deciding what is important for me to have access to, and I don't feel right doing the same for my students.
But of course, I am not blind or visually impaired, so I don't want to make decisions for others, so I'm asking you...
In your opinion, should images include alt text, even if the image is not related to the academic content? I'm interested in reading a variety of responses.
I am Deaf, and have had the unfortunate experience of others deciding what is important for me to have access to, and I don't feel right doing the same for my students.
But of course, I am not blind or visually impaired, so I don't want to make decisions for others, so I'm asking you...
In your opinion, should images include alt text, even if the image is not related to the academic content? I'm interested in reading a variety of responses.
NovemberGoat 7 points 2y ago
Access to the visual world should never be restricted just because it doesn't pertain to the academic subject being studied. A school environment shouldn't just prepare students for the outside world, it should represent it. This feels incredibly insensitive and miss-guided on the part of your colleague. The line they've taken says to me 'access for all, but not to all'.
258professor [OP] 3 points 2y ago
Thank you for your response. I liked your first sentence.
Marconius 3 points 2y ago
If the image is decorative, hide it from screen readers. If the image is informative, provide alt text describing the image. Include any text that's in the image itself, describe the image within the scope and context of the surrounding content, and don't add things like "image of" or "picture of..." as that gets redundant.
For charts and graphs, you must provide alt text with the data values, or otherwise provide the actual data table used to create the chart/graph and make it accessible with proper row/column headers and formatting. You can also provide a link to a plain text long description of more complex graphs, and that would contain a paragraph or two of exactly what you would say if you were presenting all the data verbally.
Keep alt text under 150 characters to keep it brief and understandable.
You can accomplish the progress incentive announcements in other ways if it's dynamic instead of focusing on the checkmark graphic. You could use plain text at the bottom of the article which will accomplish the same text of the graphic. If the checkmark appears after the user performs some task, make text appear as well and use aria-live to have it get announced to the screen reader. Fussing over icons and decorations and adding alt text to it just adds clutter and makes the experience more frustrating to a screen reader user, so again, hide them all unless they are informing the user about something in the content or if a point is being made with the image.
For charts and graphs, you must provide alt text with the data values, or otherwise provide the actual data table used to create the chart/graph and make it accessible with proper row/column headers and formatting. You can also provide a link to a plain text long description of more complex graphs, and that would contain a paragraph or two of exactly what you would say if you were presenting all the data verbally.
Keep alt text under 150 characters to keep it brief and understandable.
You can accomplish the progress incentive announcements in other ways if it's dynamic instead of focusing on the checkmark graphic. You could use plain text at the bottom of the article which will accomplish the same text of the graphic. If the checkmark appears after the user performs some task, make text appear as well and use aria-live to have it get announced to the screen reader. Fussing over icons and decorations and adding alt text to it just adds clutter and makes the experience more frustrating to a screen reader user, so again, hide them all unless they are informing the user about something in the content or if a point is being made with the image.
258professor [OP] 1 points 2y ago
I appreciate your comments. I guess there could be some debate over what is considered decorative. I think informing students of the instructor's skin color and type of dress is informative, but maybe others do not? As for a checkmark, I just feel that it can contribute to a student's sense of well-being, or like a "good job" after completing tasks. Would you prefer to not have that kind of extraneous information?
Marconius 2 points 2y ago
If the tasks are dynamic, and I'm checking things off and getting my input evaluated on the fly like with Codecademy, then it's perfectly fine to pop up a modal or checkmark image provided it's easily able to be cleared and that the alt text or adjacent text is informative. alt text that says "A green checmark" is not inclusive, but "Great job completing this task!" is perfectly fine.
If it's just a static image, then hide it or provide what you are trying to convey with the image in the alt text. I prefer not having icons strewn around the page since it just adds to the cognitive load of navigating through the information. I'd rather not have to continuously have to navigate through extraneous imagery or elements that are not important nor pertinent to the information being conveyed on the page or course.
As for describing the instructor, I'm fine with that since I personally like to know what people look like. Just understand that not all blind users have had visual context, so it's important to use inclusive language in the descriptions
If it's just a static image, then hide it or provide what you are trying to convey with the image in the alt text. I prefer not having icons strewn around the page since it just adds to the cognitive load of navigating through the information. I'd rather not have to continuously have to navigate through extraneous imagery or elements that are not important nor pertinent to the information being conveyed on the page or course.
As for describing the instructor, I'm fine with that since I personally like to know what people look like. Just understand that not all blind users have had visual context, so it's important to use inclusive language in the descriptions
FantasticGlove 1 points 2y ago
Personally, I think the check mark thing would be fun to have and yeah, it is nice to have descriptions of non-academic things because we do more in classrooms than just look at charts and graphs lol. For charts and graphs, I totally recommend using Excel to properly make the charts accessible and it’s easy because if they are properly labeled, we can just read and manipulate the data if we need to. I love using Excel.
Superfreq2 3 points 2y ago
I'd say ask your VI students what they think first of all...
But in general, the more the better. If you have the time to do it right (it isn't necessary to be ultra descriptive unless the info is vital to completing the assignment or navigating the page) than please do.
Otherwise, it's a priorities thing. I'd rather have only the most important stuff over a patchy mix of important and less important, or one size fits all brief descriptions for everything across the board whether decorative or vital.
I would also try a screen reader on the site for your self. If you feel like you can get everything done without captions, than it can help inform your decision, though again I would always consult with VI students too.
But in general, the more the better. If you have the time to do it right (it isn't necessary to be ultra descriptive unless the info is vital to completing the assignment or navigating the page) than please do.
Otherwise, it's a priorities thing. I'd rather have only the most important stuff over a patchy mix of important and less important, or one size fits all brief descriptions for everything across the board whether decorative or vital.
I would also try a screen reader on the site for your self. If you feel like you can get everything done without captions, than it can help inform your decision, though again I would always consult with VI students too.
258professor [OP] 3 points 2y ago
I appreciate your response. I haven't had any VI students, yet. My fear is because this is coming from a person who is training multiple people on campus, this could become a widespread practice. If I can be brutally honest, it feels lazy to just check "decorative image" than to type a couple of sentences.
[deleted] 2 points 2y ago
[deleted]
258professor [OP] 2 points 2y ago
I'm speaking mostly of using Canvas, our LMS. The instructor's face was on an introduction page that tells about the instructor's background. My feeling was that maybe students like to know if their instructor is black, white, or dresses neat, or has a silly portrait photo, but maybe not.
For me, decorative is like flowers or leaves that you would put on a border. But even that can be nice if students can have access to know what it is, rather than "decorative". I wouldn't put a person's portrait as a border on a homepage, so I don't consider it "decorative". I also couldn't swap that photo out for a picture of flowers. The photo serves a specific purpose that is relevant to the page.
The green checkmark is just a photo that is at the bottom of the page. If you've completed all of the items, then you're done! I feel that this gives a sense of completion... like "whew, now I can relax for the weekend". It's more of a psychological support for students rather than academic.
But these are just my opinions, I don't want to speak out if blind people really don't care.
For me, decorative is like flowers or leaves that you would put on a border. But even that can be nice if students can have access to know what it is, rather than "decorative". I wouldn't put a person's portrait as a border on a homepage, so I don't consider it "decorative". I also couldn't swap that photo out for a picture of flowers. The photo serves a specific purpose that is relevant to the page.
The green checkmark is just a photo that is at the bottom of the page. If you've completed all of the items, then you're done! I feel that this gives a sense of completion... like "whew, now I can relax for the weekend". It's more of a psychological support for students rather than academic.
But these are just my opinions, I don't want to speak out if blind people really don't care.
Purple-Mallard 1 points 2y ago
I use canvas to access my course and are use a screen reader. I feel that it is cluttered enough as it is and adding image descriptions for things that aren't strictly relevant will just make it frustrating.
If I was you I would just hide all of the irelevant images and make it as clean as possible
If I was you I would just hide all of the irelevant images and make it as clean as possible
_Shermaniac_ 1 points 1y ago
I think it's also not great to take alt-text as pinnacle accessibility. You can do semantically so much more with captions. You can use other semantic html elements to make it more palatable and navigable. You can also use CSS to hide captions that are bulky and unnecessary for anyone who are able to see the image while it will also still be consumable by screen readers.
Essentially, you can't use any of the semantically useful stuff in an alt attribute. The caption is far more useful and can pick up the slack. It's worth considering.
Essentially, you can't use any of the semantically useful stuff in an alt attribute. The caption is far more useful and can pick up the slack. It's worth considering.
oncenightvaler 1 points 2y ago
It's becoming more and more important. e.g. So yesterday I had to take a test for an editing position, and the original layout of the test was with a lot of pictures, but then someone had obviously gone through the trouble to describe all the relevant information in the pictures, thus making the test easy for my refreshable Braille display screen.
SightlessKombat 1 points 2y ago
Alt text is, in a word, crucial. In part, this is because it allows a person to understand what is in the image itself, but it also allows them to engage on a deeper level with the conversations surrounding that image, if any and thus be a part of the culture and integrated with their friends, colleagues etc.
As an accessibility consultant, I've had many instances where a company will say "here's this amazing thing we have to show you" and all you get next is "image". That one word, without any alt text, does not tell me anything. It could be anything from a blade of grass to a complex 3d-printed character costume. This usually results in me having to ask what the image is, thus potentially making for a frustrating back and forth conversation,, especially if nobody actually knows what alt text is.
Adding alt text just makes it easier for everyone in the long term.
As an accessibility consultant, I've had many instances where a company will say "here's this amazing thing we have to show you" and all you get next is "image". That one word, without any alt text, does not tell me anything. It could be anything from a blade of grass to a complex 3d-printed character costume. This usually results in me having to ask what the image is, thus potentially making for a frustrating back and forth conversation,, especially if nobody actually knows what alt text is.
Adding alt text just makes it easier for everyone in the long term.
258professor [OP] 1 points 2y ago
Thank you for your comments. And I get the irony of people showing an accessibility consultant something that's not accessible!
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