Blind and Visually Impaired Community
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Braille dots (self.Blind)
submitted by Broken-Bold
I'm sorry if this is a stupid question.
For braille dots, what's the smallest size they can each be without having difficulty understanding them.
I'm making a smartwatch and I've gone through multiple concepts. So far I just want to ensure the braille dots aren't too small or too big.
For braille dots, what's the smallest size they can each be without having difficulty understanding them.
I'm making a smartwatch and I've gone through multiple concepts. So far I just want to ensure the braille dots aren't too small or too big.
FaerilyRowanwind 3 points 2y ago
http://www.brailleauthority.org/sizespacingofbraille/sizespacingofbraille.pdf
CloudyBeep 2 points 2y ago
The Dot is a braille watch that uses refreshable braille. They have had some problems. You should learn from their mistakes.
Broken-Bold [OP] 2 points 2y ago
I've taken a lot of inspiration from DOT and hoping to work on their issues
charliesdesk 2 points 2y ago
There is a standard size for braille dots that is available online. I would recommend doing more research before embarking on this project. Maybe you should set up a conversation with someone who reads braille
charliesdesk 2 points 2y ago
I wouldn’t say it is a stupid question at all, but I would say it is a question that indicates more research on your part is necessary. The blind community is very accustomed to people designing quote unquote break through technology that were made without consulting deeply with a very diverse community.
737257 2 points 2y ago
the size seen in books/embossed on paper is pretty much the limit for a regular sized finger. unfortunately its not as easy to make braille small as it is for text... by the way how would you even make the braille tactile on a smart watch? very interesting concept
edit: heres a link to braille standards if that helps. if you can find the measurements for the braille seen in books thats pretty much your minimum in my opinion ($1)
edit: heres a link to braille standards if that helps. if you can find the measurements for the braille seen in books thats pretty much your minimum in my opinion ($1)
Broken-Bold [OP] 1 points 2y ago
I'll give one concept as this one is still in debate.
By using static braille it will sit on the outside like standard analogue watches. As the wearer will be visually impaired and required to touch the face of the watch to know what time it is.
I'll be using small rectangle braille pieces/hands that sit into different levels. Both hands being different sizes and allow touch to be used.
Another concept would be to use the same structure and use Morse code via sound or vibration to communicate the four digits.
By using static braille it will sit on the outside like standard analogue watches. As the wearer will be visually impaired and required to touch the face of the watch to know what time it is.
I'll be using small rectangle braille pieces/hands that sit into different levels. Both hands being different sizes and allow touch to be used.
Another concept would be to use the same structure and use Morse code via sound or vibration to communicate the four digits.
737257 3 points 2y ago
ah this makes a lot of sense. when you said smartwatch i thought you meant like those little phone things people put on their wrists
Broken-Bold [OP] 1 points 2y ago
Sorry for the miss communication, what I'm trying to do is so similar to re-inventing the wheel.
So hopefully it takes off well.
So hopefully it takes off well.
tysonedwards 3 points 2y ago
I am a hardware and accessibility engineer with experience that might be relevant.
When it comes to braille, there are a few things that can ease differentiation without increasing physical height, such as texture coatings. That can allow you to simplify designs allowing for direct piezo arrays rather than relying on cams or servos.
Typically, braille assumes emboss or deboss of a single material, so height separation is important to allow the finger to sense the texture difference. By employing material differentation such as a Metal or Glass surface and Rubber Coated Pin, it is very obvious the actuation state with very limited height differentiation. It then becomes a multi-part design with an overlayment with holes milled for the actuators, the actuators beneath with coating applied to each pin, and then your electronics layer.
There is also research into electrostatic haptics to change the tactile sensation of materials.
I have a couple designs with the goal to create a phone backplate where the user can “braille type” in addition to feeling key haptic stimulation beneath their fingers to simulate a mechanical key bounce. Right now, it is about the size of a desktop keyboard.
Something to keep in mind: People spend a VERY long time learning how to read braille. Inventing something new means previous knowledge and muscle memory is thrown away and requires re-learning.
Much like how a sighted person may know how to read, learning to hand write, then how to type on a smartphone, and then on laptop keyboard are very different skills that require time and practice.
When it comes to braille, there are a few things that can ease differentiation without increasing physical height, such as texture coatings. That can allow you to simplify designs allowing for direct piezo arrays rather than relying on cams or servos.
Typically, braille assumes emboss or deboss of a single material, so height separation is important to allow the finger to sense the texture difference. By employing material differentation such as a Metal or Glass surface and Rubber Coated Pin, it is very obvious the actuation state with very limited height differentiation. It then becomes a multi-part design with an overlayment with holes milled for the actuators, the actuators beneath with coating applied to each pin, and then your electronics layer.
There is also research into electrostatic haptics to change the tactile sensation of materials.
I have a couple designs with the goal to create a phone backplate where the user can “braille type” in addition to feeling key haptic stimulation beneath their fingers to simulate a mechanical key bounce. Right now, it is about the size of a desktop keyboard.
Something to keep in mind: People spend a VERY long time learning how to read braille. Inventing something new means previous knowledge and muscle memory is thrown away and requires re-learning.
Much like how a sighted person may know how to read, learning to hand write, then how to type on a smartphone, and then on laptop keyboard are very different skills that require time and practice.
FaerilyRowanwind 2 points 2y ago
Are you intending refreshable Braille? Honestly. It way be too much for the watch face. It also has to do with where you orient things and how close they are together.
Broken-Bold [OP] 2 points 2y ago
I have two concepts for the use of braille.
The first one does use refreshable braille in which sits in the middle of the watch face and should be of decent proportions.
The second version will be using static braille in replacement of the basic numbers. It's true that the face could be too small, but I will try to ensure that doesn't make the case.
The first one does use refreshable braille in which sits in the middle of the watch face and should be of decent proportions.
The second version will be using static braille in replacement of the basic numbers. It's true that the face could be too small, but I will try to ensure that doesn't make the case.
FaerilyRowanwind 2 points 2y ago
Many Braille watches don’t have numbers all the way round snd instead have individual dots that you count. The refreshable Braille may be rough only because of how those pins work. You are talking a super expensive watch that moisture would wreck
Broken-Bold [OP] 2 points 2y ago
That's also very true, but with the resources at hand. It's possible to ensure moisture doesn't destroy the mechanism.
The reason why number will be assigned as well as this will be a smart watch catered for both impaired and non. Additionally this would will have a panic system. So the idea is to ensure all groups are safe whilst knowing the time.
The idea of individual dots sounds good, thank you for the idea and I'll use it to ensure the watch design is correct and suitable.
The reason why number will be assigned as well as this will be a smart watch catered for both impaired and non. Additionally this would will have a panic system. So the idea is to ensure all groups are safe whilst knowing the time.
The idea of individual dots sounds good, thank you for the idea and I'll use it to ensure the watch design is correct and suitable.
FaerilyRowanwind 3 points 2y ago
There are some great watches on the maxi aides website that you could take a look at in terms of your design. Some include a clear openable watch face that may work well for a digital refreshable brailke clock face. A button you press to tell you the time so that the refreshable Braille isn’t always working or having to work may be an idea as well.
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