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Blind and Visually Impaired Community

Full History - 2022 - 05 - 30 - ID#v199f9
7
Blind Linux users, some questions. (self.Blind)
submitted by r_1235
I am learning a bit of programming, and wanted to dabble in to the linux world. I am coming from Windows and NVDA, so, my understand of Orca remains limited to what little experience I had with Ubuntu Gnome.

1. I tried Fidora, on a VM, it didn't work, voice ov Orca was crackling, any suggestions to fix that? Was using VMware on windows.
2. What distro would you recommend? I know about accessible coconut, but, any other suggestions?
3. Further, I was trying for a headless installation, where I would just SSh in to the machine using another windows laptop. How accessible this is?
4. Lastly, I was trying to build Mimic TTS for windows, using Ubuntu, as per the instructions on their website. But, I ran in to several errors. Anyone tried this TTS yet? is the voice good?

Thank you!
Fridux 5 points 1y ago
If you just want to get familiar with Linux and are running Windows 10 or later, why not try installing a distribution on the Windows Subsystem for Linux? It's better than a virtual machine since it runs without containment so it makes sharing files between Windows and Linux easy, and it provides you with the full command-line Linux experience while taking advantage of the accessibility that you are already used to on Windows. You won't get the native Linux graphical user interface desktop experience, but experience of using Linux on the desktop is not required anywhere.

Another cheap option that will provide you with the full accessible Linux desktop experience, which is sadly not feasible at the moment due to the chip shortage, is to buy a Raspberry Pi and use it as a Linux box. Since the Raspberry Pi runs primarily on SD cards, installing Linux on it is just a matter of downloading a disk image, flashing it on the card using your PC, and then booting the Pi with it. The official Raspberry Pi OS is as accessible as it gets, even asking you whether you wish to enable Orca during installation, and Firefox works perfectly on it, while other distributions such as Alpine and Gentoo make it easy to perform a remote headless installation.

I personally use Alpine Linux on MacOS with Docker and Raspberry Pi OS on a Raspberry Pi 400. Whenever I need to debug a booting problem on the Raspberry Pi I connect it to my Mac using a cheap HDMI to USB dongle and use VOCR to read from its physical display connection. It is also possible to debug kernel problems using an old school serial connection, but I don't think you'll be needing that for a while.
gunfart 2 points 1y ago
i honestly never heard of this before and just did about five minutes of googling then instantly went to install it. it was an absolute breeze and i now have a fully native ubuntu command prompt sitting in my windows 10 desktop environment... this feels slightly disturbing yet nice at the same time.

thanks for pointing this feature out, i am surely going to mention it to others that may be interested in learning linux. especially the IT instructor at my local center for the blind
r_1235 [OP] 1 points 1y ago
I have used WSL. But, again, if I wanted to host a server, Nass or whatever, for my home network, I would like to have this running on my other laptop, without consuming lot of power, without even using the screen. So, was wondering if a lightwait Headless installation would just keep the screen off. And SMB won't work, don't want that. Further, learning remotely controling a linux machine would be very useful to me.

Eventually I'll get to a rasbery py, but just in beginning, I would like to learn it on just the hardware I already have. Repurposing old hard disks and laptops etc.
Fridux 1 points 1y ago
A headless installation does not necessarily mean that the screen will be off, however since Linux supports power management, the screen is likely to be turned off by the system after a couple of minutes of console idle time regardless of whether you install remotely or locally using an accessible distribution such as Debian or others mentioned in this thread. Furthermore I wouldn't recommend a headless installation on random hardware to a beginner, since in most cases you will need to create your own bootable image and configure it to enable networking and a secure shell server automatically, a process that is not trivial to get right and which does not provide many debugging options.
r_1235 [OP] 1 points 1y ago
Will try a normal version first, then move on to headless version. Will be following online tutorials in that regard. Someone recommended Linux mint, have downloaded the ISO, let's see how the experience with Orca is, in a VM. If I like it, will put it on laptop. But, later on, will see which one is best for headless installation. Don't want to do too much configuring and debugging on my own, so whichever works, I'll use that. I just don't want to deal with GUI on this other laptop, want to put it away in a corner, let it run a oporating system for experimental things that I wanna try. Don't want it giving off too much heat either.

I guess, At this time, it's just experimentation and learning for me.
Wooden_Suit5580 3 points 1y ago
I have a few questions regarding this topic myself. I am totally blind, I use Windows computers and Mac computers regularly with screen readers. NVDA, Jose, and Apple voiceover I’m very familiar and comfortable with using all my laptops.
I would like to know what are some advantages of using Linux?
Where is a good place to start learning Lennox?
I have been curious about setting up a raspberry pie for the last couple of years to do different tasks. I know that I have to do some programming to get the things that I want it to do to work. I’ve watched videos on YouTube on how to program raspberry pi. Are those steps similar to what you would use on Linux?
Thank you very much. If anybody could recommend any resources for a Linux newbie to start it would be greatly appreciated.
Hope all are well.
gunfart 3 points 1y ago
depending on what distro you choose (most likely you'd be using raspian since it's as simple to install as slapping it on a micro sd card and powering on the pi.

as far as the commands go, they're pretty much exactly the same, with a few minor changes to things because it's running on arm architecture and not x86. this may limit a few things you can do as far as available software/drivers/etc goes, however as a beginner you shouldn't have any problems at all. good luck!
r_1235 [OP] 3 points 1y ago
I am a beginner, so, I don't know much.

But, it has some very specific programming related advantages I've heard. Also, If you wanna set up a Nass server, or any kind of server in your home network, Linux might be a good choice. Most of IT stuff also happens on Linux, so, good to know. Further, I have a spare laptop, and I thought experimenting and learning on it, be it creating some servers for my home network, running various things, it might be cool. So, I am doing it.
gunfart 2 points 1y ago
i dig the enthusiasm! that's sometimes the best way to learn stuff, by just diving in. being totally blind myself, it just feels nice to feel like a keyboard wizard sometimes lol.

i remember my first distro way way back in the day, redhat 6.2. i bought it at a flea market for like $5 and fumbled around with it on a 75mhz packard bell i got from somewhere as a kid. since the internet wasn't far much more than aol, msn chat, and internet explorer (in my world at least) i learned from some old irc friends over many years. i had tons of fun learning so much by just breaking and having to fix stuff. plus, recycling old hardware for linux servers is a fun way to put new life in them
retrolental_morose 3 points 1y ago
I've been coding for 25years and never needed anything outside the shell. Be it hobby work or professional stuff, connecting via a serial port or through ssh, a GUI on linux has never appealed.
r_1235 [OP] 2 points 1y ago
Also, I have red Orca's keyboard shortcuts, and even some tutorials on Youtube. But, I am strugling with navigating through lot of of user interface elements. Any nice article or tutorial for this? I don't suppose NVDA would run there?
mdizak 1 points 1y ago

Quickly because I am busy, but I can highly recommend https://linuxmint.com/. There's no problems, it just simply works, comes pre-installed with Orca. The installer also has Orca pre-installed, so you can do the entire install totally blind without assistance. Just get to that start screen, press Ctrl+Alt+T and type "orca", and you'll be able to go through the install yourself there.

Unsure what issues you were having with Orca, but there is none on my end. Yep, logging in to remote machines is totally fine. I do it probably 40 times every day on multiple machines and servers.
r_1235 [OP] 1 points 1y ago
For example, Firefox didn't work. I think some accessibility option needs to be enabled, but, I couldn't get Orca to speak anything in firefox, so, I couldn't enable whatever option that needed enabling. Also, it didn't speak about icons on desktop, or, the home window, not sure what the lingo is used there. I am okay with just copy-pasting commands in terminal window, but, sometimes, I need to get those commands from some website, so, thought having a working web browzer would be useful.
gunfart 1 points 1y ago
as a linux user, i am a bit biased towards what distro to use because i personally prefercentos, though for a beginner wanting/needing accessibility i would suggest looking towards ubintu. you can download and try out a live cd of the distro, which also includes the orca screen reader within the desktop environment (starting and stopping with the windows+s keys, or windows+alt+s? i can't exactly remember)

i would also suggest a headless machine, which is super convenient if you only run strictly terminal like i do. that way, you only need your screen reader and an ssh client and you're pretty much off to the races. you may find some difficulty in navigating menus in things that use ncurses, but there isn't a ton of terminal specific applications that use menus (unless you really like to use nmcli or something). going the headless route may also bring a few hurdles when installing; at least, i required about 5 minutes of sighted assistance during the centos 7 install process because there's no screen reader with the gui or included at all. wasn't too difficult though because it was literally "hey click the next button, don't bother with configuring i can do that after it's installed just get me past the prompts please" for the most part.

all & all, if you're brand new to the linux world i suggest grabbing the latest ubuntu live disk and giving it a shot. orca does kinda suck and there's quite a bit of a learning curve (at least, i had a difficult time just navigating around the xfce desktop environment so i stick to console only)

if you have any questions, i can do my best to assist though it isn't too difficult if you have a basic understanding of how to use a computer in general.
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