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What are some of the first genes transcribed for long term memory? Also - let's talk about the biochemical differences between long term and working memory (self.neuroscience)
submitted 11y ago by aefane
Hi All -
So, I was under the impression that working memory involved the phosphorylation of various proteins, whereas long term memory involved the transcription of various genes into proteins. That is a high level biochemical summary.
As far as the title is concerned, CREB would come to mind first. What do you all have to say in this matter?
So, I was under the impression that working memory involved the phosphorylation of various proteins, whereas long term memory involved the transcription of various genes into proteins. That is a high level biochemical summary.
As far as the title is concerned, CREB would come to mind first. What do you all have to say in this matter?
[deleted] 1 points
[deleted]
MondoMando37 1 points
First of all, the two occur in completely different places. Working memory is found in the PFC. I don't know much more about it than that. Long term memories are formed in the hippocampus. The steps require the activation of NMDA, allowing calcium influx into the cell. Activation of PKC, CaMKII, and other kinases phosphorylate AMPA receptors which increases excitability. Not fully understood mechanisms then move internal AMPA receptors to the membrane which further increases the strength of the cell. Finally, the eventual activation of CREB leads to the transcription/translation of new genes.
rscarson 1 points
Huh, so it turns out I know nothing about neuroscience :(
I thought memory was due to the electrical activation of neurons, and the subsequent chemical changes, strengthening or weakening, to their connections.
I thought memory was due to the electrical activation of neurons, and the subsequent chemical changes, strengthening or weakening, to their connections.
aefane [OP] 3 points
Sure is mein fruend. But let's think about it, what do you mean when you say "subsequent chemical changes"? Well, you're probably talking about transcription of various genes. Perhaps you're talking about kinases doing their thing. Even if you consider new synapses forming between neurons, you're talking about a new physical aspect to the cell that's going to involve transcription of some kind. Either way, nothing you described was mutually exlusive with what I'm talking about, it's just on a slightly different timescale, and more focused on a higher level effect.
I work in this aspect of the field so if you have any more questions feel free to ask :)
I work in this aspect of the field so if you have any more questions feel free to ask :)
rscarson 1 points
Thanks for the response! as a software developer, I often work with neural networks, but do biological neurons store and data directly, or is all the data in links between them?
[deleted] 1 points
I know that it's been 27 days since your post, but I only recently discovered /r/neuroscience (and /r/neuro even more recently - so I can understand if this post is dead), but I came across this today: http://www.mit.edu/newsoffice/2012/conjuring-memories-artificially-0322.html
Appears that memory can be encoded in a very small number of neurons as opposed to large scale networks.
Appears that memory can be encoded in a very small number of neurons as opposed to large scale networks.
rscarson 1 points
Interesting, so neurons do infact store data internally. This confirms what I read a while ago about single neurons being able to differentiate complex sources of stimuli.
[deleted] 1 points
As a neuroimaging analyst, I often develop simple programs to automate my data processing. It's useful to think about brain function in a computational manner, but it won't capture the complexity of neural function at the level of the whole brain. Neurons are not like bytes, they don't solely represent a binary state. I know I oversimplified your analogy - it could be that neurons each store a larger number of states, but it's more likely links between them that encode patterns of environmental and internal stimuli. If you look at recent studies into AI that attempt to re-create patterns of neural function with computer hardware, you'll find that your latter suggestion is supported.
I was thinking about going into some basic computational modeling based on weighted connections as an example, but I shall leave that to you, if you're interested.
I was thinking about going into some basic computational modeling based on weighted connections as an example, but I shall leave that to you, if you're interested.
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